We started to discuss gender last week in relation to the documentary and also our conversation about choosing to have children or not and perceptions that people have. I'd like to continue that conversation this week.
What does it mean to be "feminine"? Conversely, we could ask what it means to be "masculine." What does it mean to "argue like a man"? Just today, I read this interview in The Times. The author of the book under review, comedy writer Nell Scovell writes that when her boss, Gary Shandling, complimented her for writing comedy "like a man," she was flattered. But now she doesn't find it flattering. What changed? How might we connect this quote to Sotomayor's quote about "arguing like a man"?
What other questions does the end of the book raise for you? What was most engaging for you about the book? What did you have the most difficulty with?
What does it mean to be male or female? The meaning is obviously broad in every sense. However, at the level of intellect there is much similarity. Even many women could be better than men in many fields of work.
ReplyDeleteThe descion of having children or not in a couple could have many reasons. In the case of Sonia Sotomayor, it was for her health and conscientiousness not to transfer her illness to her decency. Particularly I find it very fair and intelligent. It can also be a decision taken for being very young, for wanting to wait to have children, because simply none of the parties want it.
Why speak like a man, I think Sonia reflects authority and decision when she refers to speaking like a man. In the article, I'm not sure either because of the same idea, or because the author changed her mind after being praised for writing that comedy.
My beliefs is that everyone should be who they want to be, without being defined (masculine or feminine). I think in society some people beliefs: feminine means, girlie, what you wear eg. heels, makeup. Whereas, A man being told that he's masculine is looked as strong, tough, control, powerful, driven.
ReplyDeleteIts sad that masculinity and femininity is define in that way.
I think "arguing like a man", I think that it means women arguing like a man, it makes a women more likely to be taken seriously, makes what a woman is saying more authoritative.
I was particularly struck to realize that Sonia lost some of the closest persons in her life.(Abuelity, Nelson and Fran) Fortunately they all left a very important piece of them with her thoughts that are vital in her career today.
ReplyDeleteWhat also helped my understanding while reading My Beloved is the Spanish-English glossary.
ReplyDeletein the back of the book there's a glossary which gives the definition for the words used in the book.
DeleteYes!!!!
DeleteMen and women are good are difenrence things, but Sonia is very brilliant lawyer very good in the court. she not afraid to learn new things. when she is proseuting the case with steve Hyman and his friend D"Alesso for selling "Kiddle porn" tapes to the undercover police she demonstrated to the judge that these two men are criminals and she got them convicted and they are sentence to jail, Sonia can do any anything she sets her mind to do.Sonia"s friends thought she will not be able to get conviction for example Hugh said go to the bathroom and throw up because you are nervous. Most of the men lawyers thought men are better lawyers than women lawyers
DeleteI think our society today is way different than what it used to be many years ago. If a woman was called masculine back in the days it will be more like a compliment but now they have realized that they can make a name for themselves and they don't have to be compared to the men.
ReplyDeleteI think it's interesting to think of Sotomayor "dressing badly" in order to get people to engage w/ her mind. Clearly she feels better about herself now that she's more fashionable. But I wonder, does it matter? Why do we judge people by the way they look?
ReplyDeleteI also want to revisit this idea of "arguing like a man." I think it's bogus like the idea of writing comedy like a man or playing tennis like a man or whatever. Why can't they do it like a woman? Or just do it and excel? Maybe actions don't have to be gendered. What do we gain by making them so?
I think people judge others by how they look based upon first impression, "the saying is first impression last longer" meaning you will remember the person by their first impression.
DeleteI think that Sotomayor sort of had the right idea by "dressing badly". She wanted to feel that people were not looking at how she looked or dressed but to look at what she was capable of without being judged. I think the media has a lot to do with why we judge people on the way they look. Magazine, TV, and social media have shaped our perception on what is acceptable.
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DeleteYes, looking back at page 361, I understand that Sonia wanted people to judge her for her mind and not her physical appearance, but unfortunately, the media plays a big part with people judging others by how they look based upon first impression its very sad.
DeleteI believe that feminism and being masculine is a opinonated assumption based on whom is judging. What one person thinks is very masculine another could think it more feminine. The sad part of these two words is people are sometimes stereotyped by how they act, i remember when i was in high school if a boy was very feminine which mean "flamboyant" some would say girly, they would assume the person would most likely be gay.
ReplyDeleteI personally, even as a woman don't find that type of comparison to be sexist or offensive. When saying "You argue like a man" just means you make a good strong argument, because men have always symbolized something that is strong, or powerful. I would have taken it as a compliment. The same comments can be directed to a man, kind of like "you are too sensitive like a woman" I actually think that's more offensive, than making a comment to a woman comparing her to something that is powerful, strong, and superior.
ReplyDeleteI found the last few chapters very engaging because Sonia spoke about her weaknesses and strengths. Sonia went back to letting her readers know that even through her adult life she still struggled with her diabetes, she struggled to quit smoking,she still didn't know how to dress. I love how she let us know how she overcome those hiccups in her life. She also spoke about learning to dance, swim and to throw a ball. So even though she had to grow up too soon and lost part of her childhood, she still found time to cash up with some of these things. While still striving for a career as a judge. She never lost focus.
ReplyDeleteWhat was most engaging me? The internal strength of Sonia was that trough pages of " My Beloved World" the most important message. How she say at the interview on pg. 368 " I'm not intimidated by challenges. My whole life has been one. I look forward to engaging the work and learning how to do it well" it is wonderful way to face the life.
ReplyDeleteIn todays society and in past generations, we've adopted and coined many terms to signify male dominance over women. "Argue like a man" is definitely one of them showing the power of how labels create a stigma towards women. Being a man is no greater than being a women, its just how this particular country celebrates its gender roles by greatly seperating them at the same time.
ReplyDeleteMeaning of being feminine to my knowledge is knowing how to do things in a classy way. Masculine is strong aggressive. What might of change why Sonia wasn't flattered is because she's a woman why can't she feel how she feels why doe sit have to be like a man ? I find it insulting my opinion
ReplyDeleteI believe that everyone should be who they want to be there no need to be named feminist or masculine. there some people who view theses words a diffrent way from others, my person opinion when i see these words is being girly bossy and a wanna be girl who think she knows everything, masculine to be meaning strong tough and brave. Others may disagree and have another prespective of that meaning
ReplyDelete" arguging like a man" i feel like it means either male or feamale someone who speaks up, being tough someone who takes it seriouse when they speak.
The relation between Sotomayor and Scovell, is that they are women who excelled in their careers. For that reason they are compared to a man, because they are one of the best at what they do. Men I think feel a little overwhelmed, when a woman is "equal" to them (I'm not saying all men). When men see a woman that can do something better or just as good as them, they might feel intimidated. It's hard for society to change their ways. Although we have achieved so much over time women are still look at less than. It's hard to believe that we still live in a time where some people still believe in gender roles.
ReplyDeleteI really enjoyed reading Sotomayor's story. Although, she does leave out the intimate details that I wanted to know, I can understand why she left them out. Somethings you want to be hold on to for yourself. I was sad to read what happened with her cousin. But it was inspiring to hear her story. She overcame so many obstacles with grace. She was firm in the courtroom but so loving to her nieces and nephews, which showed that she wasn't a cold person like her mother was. I don't want to use the word cold because she explains how rough her mother had to become because of the childhood she had. Her story is inspiring, a girl from the Bronx, her father passed away at a young age, a single mother, parent who were new to the country. So many aspects to her story and the outcome was success.
ReplyDeleteMost people associate women with soft , caring and sweet and usually men are viewed as strong, aggressive and powerful. So, when Rudy told Sonia she argues like a man, he was saying that she argues strongly and challenges anyone who would try an prove her wrong. And he meant it as a compliment. He said other girls that answer questions in class would have self-doubts and be apologetic but not Sonia she was straightforward. Sonia agreed and said in those days apologetic and tentative manner of speech was the norm among women. Relating that back to Nell and her boss, when he says she writes comedy like a man, I think he means she has no filter. Most men comedians can say jokes that would be funny, but when a women says the same joke its not taken the same way. Men can say dirty jokes but when a women does it, it's inappropriate and when men talk about sex, its entertaining but when a women does it it's disgusting. So I think Nell brought a comedy style that was similar to men; and her boss made her feel good at first when he said she writes comedy like a man, but I assume her perception changed, because she wasn't writing like a man she was writing like herself; and she didn't like that her credit as a women comedian was given to a man.
ReplyDeleteI don't know how I feel about her saying she dresses terribly to get people to focus on he? I say it's bs this is an excuse. What is the big deal about what people are wearing. I don't even know her and I think she's cool, not because of her title but a takes a strong soul to endure what she has and continue. As far as her being told she argues like a man, when I first read it I was a annoyed but then I came to the realization that it wasn't meant to be mean but it's because he does not know better.
ReplyDelete* her mind
ReplyDeletewhat I think was that Sonia lost some of her closest person in her life which is Abuelita. However, her closet friends left and they were important to her. In one of the chapters, Sonia spoke about her weakness and strengths. Sonia went back by talking about her adult life and that she still have diabetes, but she also quit smoking. However,she still didn't know how to dress herself in her own way.
ReplyDeleteI think being feminine is how you carry yourself how you dress how you talk. Like being nice having manners. Wearing woman clothing. Doing things that the world associates with how women should be. Same thing for being masculine. I think when Sonia says arguing like a man she refers just being more aggressive.
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